Cormyr and the Dalelands

Since the Bard class is having the likes of rapiers added to its list of proficient weapons, could the duelist also be changed to include bard weapon proficiency for its requirement?

I think they meant so that,  for example,  bard characters wouldn't have to take the martial feat.

IE have it count to meet that requirement,  not make the class require bard.

~BR

Yeah, this. Currently, martial, rogue, and elf count. Primarily because they all include finesse weapons (the common link being Rapier) in those proficiency sets. It'd be nice if a bard could take Duelist without needing to dip or start as an elf.

Well, you can take the proficiency feats without any race or having to dip in another class, but that's just it- you need to give up a feat in order to use the weapons, which can be a pain.

~BR

Either would work! I was only looking at the server's current requirements for them and not the P&P base.

To avoid starting another thread with more suggestions. I figured I'd hijack Allatum's thread with one of my own.

Given the current trend of making some prestige classes non-race-specific, given the lack of other barbarian like prestige classes (frenzied Berserker and others) I was wondering if opening up Dwarven Battlerager to all races would be on the table?

Yep. That one will be opening up too, possibly with some changes, though on the whole it works well enough.

I was just wondering why Eldritch Knight gets tumble as a class skill and not Spellsword? Does Parry even work in NWN that it was added to Weapon Master?

Parry doesn't really work well at all. You can only parry the first attack in each flurry from each of the 3 flurries in a round (1/3rd effectiveness, or 3 out of 9 possible attacks a round.) Natural 20's can't be parried, nor can ranged attacks.

As for the Tumble, I can't really comment.

~BR

Would the hak update solve the issue with sorcerers taking levels in spell-giving PrCs before lvl 18 crashing the server? (The same goes for bards, too.)

Comparing the two, Spellsword is vastly more powerful. Eldritch Knight gets absolutely no abilities save for the one free feat at first level. Spellswords are ultimately best as tanks, all of their abilities are based about armor and shields and using them with their magic. Eldritch Knights gaining Tumble and Uncanny Dodge sets a feel and design for them as a class that is more nimble and not based about armor and these two changes give them a good bit more power to close the gap between the currently underwhelming EK and the vastly more powerful Spellsword. Stylistically, Eldritch Knights are not really armored mages (Though there are the rare exceptions) but they are in combat just as much as them so it would make sense that they would be learning to evade attacks and minimize moments where they are dropping their guard.

This is a hardcoded issues that they tried to work around via scripting, I don't think haks can do anything to fix it.

Correct. There's really nothing we can do about this.

That does make a lot of sense the way you put it, thanks for explaining it. 

Was there a balance reasoning for Parry added to Wm's? Is parry handled differently on this server due to the Hak?

Parry behavior cannot be altered, as it is part of the combat engine, and hard coded into the game engine.

As to EK vs Spellsword,  the latter does have some other tweaks coming, assuming I can ever fix the issue the class currently has where it is destroying stats on chest armor.  If I can not track that down the class may have to be disabled.

Would it be possible to implement the True Necromancer PrC?

If i recall correctly, TNecro is basically just Mystic Theurge with some tacked on spell likes. There's really nothing needing it that can't be done with a MT with necro focus feats.

IIRC it stacks all levels in arcane and divine spellcasting and TNecro for necromancy spells for their effect, and it also stacks turn/rebuke undead the same way. But that was the 3e version, not the 3.5e.

Also to be old-hat. Could Druids get some of their elemental shapes a pass over for what item properties can merge? As it stands the class is getting some nice additions but it's still lackluster in a lot of places - Arcane casters do control and damage spells a lot better, clerics heal and buff better.... and (default) animal companions are subpar on a server with as much gearing as this one's got.

I'm 99% sure we can't do that due to blackboxing.

Just a word of caution, guys, as well.

While the suggestions aren't necessarily a bad thing, the haks are already several years in coming just with what they already have. Asking for more and more stuff to be added is only going to delay them longer.

If we ever want to actually see the haks happen, let's keep suggestions to smaller things - altering spell durations and access from certain classes, access to certain feats, opening race- or alignment-restricted classes, other things that are primarily editing scripts and prerequisites rather than creating new ones. No adding new classes or PrCs, no heavy mechanical adjustments like fiddling with wildshape (because that's not an easy edit, much less a quick one), etc. etc. etc.

There is one thing we could do, but it has nothing to do with haks, and would require porting the entire server back over to Linux architecture rather than Windows. There are other reasons I'd like to do this, but it's not an insignificant amount of work, and wouldn't be part of any hak update.

Would the hak update solve the issue of certain arcane spells being unable to be scribed onto a scroll?

Could you please look into the duration of Lesser Mind Blank and Mind Blank?  They have a very dodgy duration (it's certainly not the 1 turn per level it should be) and I can't find any documented changes to it that would explain why this is.

Half suggestion, but more a question of clarification! Was wondering if the RDD requirement was staying lore due to limitations from being a base class, or if it might be changed to Knowledge Arcana like the rest.

I believe it should be changing as well. We can edit the base NWN class prereqs as well, such as we're doing for AA and DwDef.

What I'm gonna ask now is a bit awkward but...
Why not set the ranger right?
Don't forget the HD is d8 not d10 so...Any possibilities?

We've done quite a bit to update Ranger to 3.5 standard, adding in Evasion and HIPS and a few other things. I think the only thing we haven't added is the ability to select other fighting styles besides Dual-Wield, which is currently not something we intend to do. The upcoming update is already adding a few things to their spell list as well, and improving some of the spells they already had (for example, Blade Thirst will work exactly the same as GMW). What else needs to be added or tweaked?

Don't you dare suggest to remove my precious d10 hit die!

I believe that was an intentional choice to leave it at d10. Pathfinder went and changed it back to d10 anyway, and believe me, there's enough of us here that would update everything to PF if we could. It also makes the class just a little more appealing to people, in addition to all the other updates we've given it since.

So no, I don't see nerfing Ranger's hit die as being something we'll do. If for no other reason than it doesn't seem to gain us anything. It doesn't encourage more people to play Rangers - in fact, it'll probably dissuade people even more - and it's not such a drastic difference from the game as to unbalance anything; having 20 or so extra HP by high level isn't going to sway the results of an event or dungeon immensely, more likely than not. It gets us nothing other than more exactly in line with 3.5, where the nerf was, to be honest, kind of pointless anyway. As I said in my last post, we've updated a lot to the Ranger to add their new features and update some of their abilities, but all of those changes were with the intent to strengthen the class and make it more appealing and more able to hold its own in CD's climate; nerfing it seems at best unnecessary and at most hostile to those who do play the class or are considering it.

Yeah, I won't be reducing ranger hit-die.  They're fine at d10.

I am not sure if those can be or will be included into the hak update, therefore the questions/suggestions:

1) Making the monks Flurry of Blows ability not auto-switching off when there are no enemies in melee range. It is now a bit of a hassle that way, and it would be IMHO better if they worked like Expertise or Power Attack and not auto-switch off -I think there is a reason why those are that way and it is a valid for Flurry of Blows, too.

2) Adding some null-helm/invisible helm models, the same way we have the invisible cloak model for cloaks. And/or making a headband/tiara helm model available. Most of the helm models are looking quite robust, not really fitting to go with a light or no armor outfit and for those characters we only have the one hood model as alternative. Some more variety would be very welcome.

Thank you for your kind consideration!

Both of these are sadly not possible.

Flurry of Blows is in the same combat blackbox as things like Power Attack and Expertise that we simply cannot tinker with. I don't know why BioWare designed them differently when they normally work so similarly, but they did and at This time there's nothing we can do about it.

The way helms work in NWN is that if a helm is equipped, it removes your head model and replaces it with the helmet design. Thus a helmet with a blank appearance would just result in a headless character. To create functional "invisible" helms, we would need to create a helmet appearance for each and every head available to pcs on every race and both genders thereof. Which we are not willing nor logistically able to do.

Understood. Thank you for enlightening me!

Teeny Tiny suggestion - Spears could use some love, in the form of being made one handed. As they stand they are a two handed piercing battleaxe. And sorely lose out on any other two hander. I also noticed that Tridents are already One handed.

As far as I know it just requires an edit in the .erf to do - I recall Narfel has no Haks and they managed to do it.

I could get behind that. Would give druids another decent weapon choice as well. Right now its kinda scimitar or nothing if you're at all melee.

Tridents exist in both a 1 handed and 2 handed version.  Very few out there though, because.... as far as I know, I'm the only one that uses them.  Fish Elf Love!

At least one of those is a CEP weapon.  I generally avoid making CEP weapon types because the weapon feats do not work with them.

Ah, my bad. Though the one handed spear suggestion still stands

Some suggestions from my side are tilesets. Aside from being bigger in size, they are quick and easy to add.

Codi Sigil Interior While the exterior is only useable for Sigil or for an Underdark city district with it's unique look (doubt either is too interresting for CD outside event content), the interior tileset is very versatile in what it can be used for. And it looks fantastic.

Azure Tower is another really nice tileset that is used far too rarely. It is small and limited in the tiles it has, but it provides a really cool unique look.

Elven Treetop City Tileset is a relativly new release. It is very pretty, and I think could work very well for either doing an update to Velethuil or using it on the event server for elven content.

Wild Woods is great at creating dense, wilderness areas.


And thank you so much for working on the hak update. Did a few of those in the past, and they really are a time intensive chore to do. Really appreciated.

Especially with a job that likes to change your schedule at the last minute. My writing projects went to Hell when that happened.


Best,
Arya

Ooo, that elven treetop one looks pretty. That would get some use.

Some spells can not be scribed onto scrolls or be brewed to be potions (like Alter Self for the later). Can the hak update fix that?

Possibly, I believe it just requires a few lines in the hak code be changed at particular locations, though Vincent will have to confirm this.

That said, some spells - masses, energy immunity, a few others - were kept that way deliberately. So those spells will likely not be changing.

A friend of mine put together some really nice clothing options a while back.


Robe Based Armors
Robe Based Armors 2
Pelt Cloaks

Oof yes, pls.

These are awesome but not compatible with mounted/jousting phenos are not 100% compatible with combat animations, to my very great sadness. They are great if you just want basic clothing though.

Any robe, to work properly, has to have a version for each race, and each phenotype of said race.  (Each combat animation variation is a different phenotype)
On top of that, due to some edits to base animation .mdl files on CD, I'm not sure that added robes would even animate properly.  In general I have avoided adding any more robe models, as putting them in properly is just too much work, and I lack the programs or ability with said programs to fix them if they fail to animate.

I think it could be useful to add Gather Information to the list of skills available. It would come very handy when somebody would do some snooping around or gathering local rumors, or trying to find somebody using connections, etc. which is usually an important part of many adventures.

Gather Information was rolled into Diplomacy in 3.5 and beyond, which is renamed to Persuade in NWN. Just use that. =)

Just to collect a few things we've discussed before that could happen during the PrC rebalance:

*Bard Proficiency should count as prequeq for Heartwarder, to reflect that PnP requires whip proficiency
*Bard Proficiency should also count for the weapon feats (focus, et al) that it would qualify.
*Bladesinger (maybe) a full progression caster? <3
*Divine Seeker - Has fighter bonus feats as bonus feats, should be roguely feats at the least, maybe the rogue bonus feats?? Also consider making it akin to the Arcane Trickster of divine casters, and add divine casting progression.
*Heartwarder is -really squishy with a d4 hit die. Could maybe make it d6?

*Straggler from pre-3.0 update: Weapon AC bonus to shield AC, rather than deflection AC

To be fair half the current robes I've tried using don't work with the custom animations anyway...

With that in mind, what model parts do work? Is it only Robes that malfunction?
Cause I could happily sit and refit models to different sets...

It would just be awesome to have some more clothing options that are... clothes... and/or... not nudity.

It's just robes that have issues with them.

Ahh sweet... when I look into the design work I'll try and go for non-robe parts.

As someone whose PC needs to remain covered at all times I appreciate you.

M-Maybe... we could... appreciate each-other... D-Dingo Sempai?

Yata!!

A bit of a selfish request, but since there aren't any really druid-specific PrCs currently on CD, I'd like to present a possibility.

Tender of Worlds - a planar druid.

The template is from the unofficial resource Legends & Lairs: Portals & Planes. I can send a copy to anyone who wants to read it.

The only implementation I've seen of it is on SPL, here: wiki.planarlegends.com/index.php?title=Tender_of_Worlds

It's a pretty fun class to play. Admittedly more RP-oriented but it has some interesting uses in certain plots.

Anyway, no biggie if it's not in the cards, but I thought I'd put it forward to give druids a PrC of their own that isn't too OP.

Druids do have Shifter, which increases their caster level and spells known now.

~BR

True! I really appreciate the fixes for them. That said, it's not a bad idea to have more than one PrC option tailored for specific classes. Diversity is good!

Posting here since it was lost in discord.

Proposed change to Mystic Theurge PrC Requirements:

Arcane Spellcasting Requirement: Level 3 Spells > Level 2 Spells
Knowledge Ranks: 6 Ranks in 3 Skills > 9 Ranks in 3 skills

Reason behind the change:
Brought this up in Discord and Edge figured it wouldn't be a bad idea. This is mostly a QoL change to allow for more diversity of MT's leveling path. The intended changes make it so that you still cannot enter the class until level 7 at the earliest, as it is now. Right now, MT is more or less shoehorned into going 5/1 to start ASAP, or 5/x and delaying progression for a more even split. The proposed change would allow for you to still use the current most common level spread or switch to a 3/3 spread at level 6 to begin the class. This allows you, as you level, to have a more divine focus with the character and brings it more in line with PnP which doesn't force the 5/1 split. As someone who would prefer to play a divine-focused theurge who dabbles in the Arcane rather than the vice-versa, this is an appealing option without us having to double up on available PrCs just to fit it.
Basically, a 3/7/10 split becomes possible at 20 rather than the typical 7/3/10 or rarer 5/5/10.

If I recall, 2/2 is how it's supposed to be in the books, but because NWN doesn't actually seem to differentiate between arcane and divine caster levels for prestige class requirements, 5/1 is the only way we can really make sure you were 6th level. It wasn't something arbitrarily chosen.

@fw

The 9 skill requirement means you, at base, have to be level 6 before you can take the class. The change would allow for a more divine heavy Theurge (Getting level 9 divine spells by 20) which isn't possible with how it's set up currently. ATM you either get level 9 arcane and level 8 divine, or you get level 8 spells in both. You can't do more divine heavy.

If you changed the requirement to be more skill based, that allows for a more cleric or Druid based theurge to still get the same usefulness/variety as an arcane one.

~BR