Half-Elves

[Yaldabaoth]

I figured I would slip this one in since the HAK update is still being worked on.  Half-Elves.  There is the long running joke about how crap they are compared to all other races.  Is there any possibility this race could get some small benefits to make them a more worthwhile option?  It would be nice to see more of them around, what with the server having a half-elf city and all.  Obviously giving them +1 dex, -1 con is right out, but what about giving them something more from the human side?  As it is, all they are is a watered down elf without stat adjustments.  Maybe give them the human bonus feat or the skill point adjustment?

[ladybug]

Mmmmm skill points.

[Vincent07]

Both the free feat, and the skill thing humans get are hard coded things tied to that race.  I sadly cannot give them to Half-Elf without causing a ton of LETO work.  At least as far as I'm aware.

[Misty]

Maybe they could be given a feat for free? Luck of Heroes. Something. Wouldn't quite raise them to the goodness than is the human base race, but it'd be something. Any change would likely be hard to implement, though do agree that.. Some kind of bonus would be nice. The few feats they get do not equal the quality of either elf or human traits.

[Arya]

What the OP said. And anything to mechanically get them on par with the standard races is good. It would also give more incentive to play half-elves over elves. I know sometimes folks pick the latter over the former for mechanics, which is okay as we all sort of do that... but again, it would really be nice to see halfies more! >.>
"
...Honestly would not be against just getting rid of half-elf and just having folks pick half-elf as a subtype for elf or human, and let folks decide which blood wins out more, with only background things such as age to help flesh out the half-elf-ness.

A thought if it was not an arm and a leg to do.


Best,
Arya

[Edge]

The main issue with "play elf or human and say you're half" is that Half-Elves, mechanically, are considered both Elf and Human for various things. So keeping them a distinct race is a necessity.

Lacking any better ideas, I looked over to PF's version of Half-Elf to see what they added differently from 3.5's. The primary difference is getting a free Skill Focus at 1st level, which they can trade for Weapon Proficiency (Elf) if they're raised by their Elven parent instead of their Human one, or for the specific Drow racial proficiencies (which NWN doesn't have a feat for) and/or Drow spell-like abilities if they're Half-Drow.

I don't particularly see this as a bad option to add, myself. It'd have to be leto'd in post-creation, of course.

[Vincent07]

Which is the main issue.  Most adjustments would require a leto.

The exception being if we just granted them a static feat.  Ie: not something they get a choice over.  That I can put in a script catch for that'll just do it on Log-in.

[LaceAndLeather]

Aug 5, 2017 9:55:20 GMT -5 Edge said:

"... a free Skill Focus at 1st level, which they can trade for Weapon Proficiency (Elf) if they're raised by their Elven parent instead of their Human one ... and/or Drow spell-like abilities if they're Half-Drow.

I don't particularly see this as a bad option to add, myself."

I love these ideas! I definitely think it would be a nice way to offset the, erm, diluted "advantages" of the existing half-elf race.

Would this be a manageable direction, or would this create an ungodly amount of LETO requests, etc.?

[Edge]

At the moment I don't think it would be a huge problem, but that's mostly because Half-Elf PCs aren't common. It wouldn't make them the only base race that requires a LETO to start - Strongheart Halflings, for example, require one.

[ladybug]

Aug 3, 2017 23:34:30 GMT -5 Vincent07 said:

Both the free feat, and the skill thing humans get are hard coded things tied to that race.  I sadly cannot give them to Half-Elf without causing a ton of LETO work.  At least as far as I'm aware.

Could the bonus skill points be kludged with an INT boost given by the subrace setter? Or does that open a new can of worms re: balance?

[Edge]

You'd end up with a race with a (minimum) +2 stat bonus and no penalty, which is normally not something available to ECL 0 races in 3.5.

[ladybug]

Ah, fair!

[lurkerabove]

Aug 7, 2017 9:27:19 GMT -5 LaceAndLeather said:

Aug 5, 2017 9:55:20 GMT -5 Edge said:

"... a free Skill Focus at 1st level, which they can trade for Weapon Proficiency (Elf) if they're raised by their Elven parent instead of their Human one ... and/or Drow spell-like abilities if they're Half-Drow.

I don't particularly see this as a bad option to add, myself."

I love these ideas! I definitely think it would be a nice way to offset the, erm, diluted "advantages" of the existing half-elf race.

Would this be a manageable direction, or would this create an ungodly amount of LETO requests, etc.?

This could actually be done as a script/conversation addition in the character start area, no hak mods or Leto needed? At the race picker for half elf, just give a list of potential bonus feats at startup and/or 4 bonus skill points, let the player pick one, presto! Yes?

[Edge]

The skillpoints thing is a flat out no-go, as you'd have to have a leto or conversation with an npc every level, and we'd have to figure out some way of ensuring it isn't grabbed twice for the same level or anything like that. Not worth the hassle.

Adding feats is a bit easier, but it's ultimately a Vincent call.

[Garage Trashcan]

Obviously we just give them the Quick To Master feat.

You know, the bonus feat that gives you a bonus feat. The epitome of BioWare's coding prowess!

I'll show myself the door.