Pickpocket

[Yaldabaoth]

Let's talk about everyone's favorite skill.  Pickpocket, known here as Sleight Of Hand allows the cunning rogue (Or Bard!) to steal a medium to small item from another player.  In order to do this successfully, the pickpocket must roll vs DC 20 or the attempt fails.  If they beat this DC, they then roll an opposed pickpocket check vs another player's spot.  As someone who has a very much thieving thief character, I have gotten quite a bit of mileage out of this skill, although I've always been very careful to ask permission first and only attempt it on players who I think will be good sports about it, and of course, I give items back if they're of a particular sentimental value, they're dm-granted items, what have you.

Which brings me to my biggest issue with the skill.  The skill can very much be abused.  It is spammable, limited only by a negligible 6 second cooldown time.  It can be used to take items that probably should not be able to be taken, but can be taken due to limitations of the toolset.  It is one of the few PvP actions you can commit on this server without your target having even the faintest inkling that it occured, which can lead to some actions that may technically be within the rules, but aren't exactly within the spirit of everyone having fun.  Because it can be done without the other person's knowledge, any abuse of the skill is nearly impossible to catch, as the target will likely not notice what happened until much later, when they search their inventory for an item that they know they had.  I know one player recently complained to me of missing quite a few unique items from DM events, and seeing other people's unique DM items turning up in the store.

Another big problem with the skill is that this 'ninja' behavior precludes RP.  There is a marked difference between RPing out accidentally bumping into someone's character, and just wordlessly rolling pickpocket checks on anyone that should be unfortunate enough to stand next to you at Hawk's.

Now, obviously I don't think the skill should be done away with, but the skill could definitely use some limitations.  I will outline a few proposals.

1.  Severely curtail spammability.  The biggest problem with the skill is that it allows a player to follow around another PC and take nearly everything they own.  Not only is this a douchey thing to do, it's hardly realistic.  A pickpocket isn't going to stand there and just keep robbing the same person over and over again.  They'll bump into the person, take their watch, and leave before the person notices that it's missing.

2. Require Hostility.  This one will probably raise a few hackles, and I admit that it's not elegant, as it can lead to metagaming.  However, it's been the solution of choice with other problematic things, like Detect Alignment spells.  The server didn't exactly deteriorate into a metagaming hellhole from that.  Instead, it required paladins to keep a check on running radar in the square, and instead saving the detect evils for when they truly needed to confirm their worst suspicions.

3. Require Roleplay.  This is the ideal solution in my mind, but nearly impossible to enforce.  Still, in an ideal world, we wouldn't have people wordlessly rolling pickpocket checks on each other.

[dagesh]

This cannot be done w/ vanilla NWN scripts.  That being said, the admins (who are quite busy w/ not only serve stuff but RL shenanigans) could add nwnx_events.  This would take more time for them to add BUT there are ways to hook into certain PC activated events like pickpocket, Animal Empathy, Hide/MS (the thing Shadowdancers use to disappear) and a few other things as well.

So, it can be tweaked but it would take time IF the admins were even willing to do that.
www.nwnx.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1535&highlight=

[onivel]

Pickpocket is a hostile action granting the person having their pocket picked PVP rights against you should you be caught. Pickpocketing on CD requires PCs to make Opposing rolls. The pickpocketer rolls Sleight of Hand and the victim as well as anyone in the near vicinity can roll Spot to see if they notice the attempt. A Sleight of Hand roll over 20 means you got something. Below means you got nothing. That said it is possible to take something, but get noticed. Just as it is to fail to take something and get noticed trying. I have always allowed the PC on the receiving end of my pickpocketing attempts to determine what was pulled. Be it some coin, a small trinket or scroll. I have only ever PPed a person once per session.

[ThayanKnight]

Although I can see the issue with spamming the skill and how it can be abused, I am of the mindset that more and complex code will not fix the problem, but targeted efforts and the staff handling any abuses would be best. I have to second what Onivel said (indirectly) that using the skill in a mature fashion wins out. We are a small community of people all getting together to enjoy a game and network together. Personally, if there is an issue with a pickpocket around, my characters would be taking IC actions to prevent and hunt down the thief!

[Fire Wraith]

The scripts presently block stealing items with Pickpocket.  You can steal gold, but not items.  It's been this way since the start of CD, unless something major has changed that I'm not aware of.

[dagesh]

The pickpocket ability someone receives when they take 1 rank of Sleight of Hand is definitely taking items.  It's hard coded normally and I don't think NWNX_Events is as old as the server.

[Yaldabaoth]

May 29, 2014 16:02:38 GMT -5 Fire Wraith said:

The scripts presently block stealing items with Pickpocket.  You can steal gold, but not items.  It's been this way since the start of CD, unless something major has changed that I'm not aware of.

This is not the case.  When I played Grace Alley more actively, I used the skill on a regular basis.  Most of the time, I received a small item, like a ring or scroll.  On one occasion, I accidentally stole a very important unique item from Tindra, which I immediately returned.  Poor Tindra caught the lion's share of Grace's thievery.  

[oarthias]

I was going to say, they are able to take items. It isn't limited to small items either. Anything outside of a container seems to be free to grab. DM story plot items included.

I don't think it is rolling spot checks for the other people in the area either, as I see anything taken from me, but when it's the person standing beside me, I'm not spotting it.

[Vincent07]

The pickpocket mechanic roll is hidden by the engine. I believe you only see it if you make the spot check.  I think I have a PC with ranks in sleight of hand, I'll have to check and see what can be done here.

[dagesh]

So, after playing around with this I think I found a fix.

First, this needs to be downloaded and installed properly:
nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=Other.Detail&id=225463&id=1537

I recommend using the following in the nwnx.ini file for the settings:
[COOL]
CriticalHit=0 ;Enable the ciritcal hit modifications (see inc_cool)
QuickChat=0 ;Enable the quickchat event
BNC=0 ;Enable the client connection event
PartyBug=0 ;Enable party action queue break hook (see inc_cool)
RemoveEffect=0 ;Enable remove effect hook (see inc_cool)
SR=0 ;Enable spell resistance hook
ALL=0 ;Enable everything
WriteToLogFile=0 ;Hook write to logfile to print to console, if 0 no console is created
TogglePauseState=0  ;Enable pause hook
weapon_hook=0 ;Enable weaponry hooks (see inc_cool)
Rand=0 ;Override nwns stanard random
GetCasterLevel=0 ;Enable casterlevel to be modified see inc_cool
CastSpell=0 ;Enable cast-spell event
ItemCastSpell=0 ;Enable item cast hook
Polymorph=0 ;Enable polymorph event
UseSkill=1 ;Enable use skill event
UseFeat=0 ;Enable use feat event
ToggleMode=0 ;Enable togglemode event
DevCrit=0 ;Enable dev crit event/critical hit
SpecialAttack=0 ;Enable special attack event
RemoveCombatInvisibility=0 ;Enable remove combat invis event (this runs alot)
AC=0 ;Enable AC override hook (see inc_cool)
AB=0 ;Same as above but for AB
ConsoleOnly=0 ;Print nwnx_cool to the console
RandomBuffer=1000 ;Randomized buffer array length
GuiTimingEvent=0 ;Enable timing bar event
CanLevelUp=0 ;Enable levelup overrides (see inc_cool)
AttackOfOpportunity=0 (hook attack of oppertuniy, 1 it can be disabled ingame, 2 its disabled)
Attack=0 ;Enable attack event
Trap=0 ;Enable trigger trap events
Log=0 ;Log level
Feat=0 ;Enable feat overrides (see inc_cool)
Bridge=0 ;Enable nwnx_bridge script for external coms (quite clonky to use still)
SetPVPPlayerLikesMe=0 ;Enable pvp list change event

Third, after the scripts have been added, add in this piece of code starting at line fifty:
   else if( nEvent == 5 ){

       SendMessageToPC( oPC, "Useskill---" );
       SendMessageToPC( oPC, "Skill ID: "+IntToString( nData ) );
       SendMessageToPC( oPC, "Target: "+GetName( GetEventTarget( ) ) );

       if( nData == SKILL_PICK_POCKET )
       {
           ByPass( 0 );
           SendMessageToPC( oPC, "You smell like cheese!" );
       }
   }

If course it can be modified to change people's cheesy smell to, perhaps, receiving gold or what not.  There are a plethora of things nwnx_cool can modify.  For example, dev crit, spell castings, and more.  Believe me it is uber and over-uber.

[Garage Trashcan]

Somebody please buy this man a beer.

[Arya]

Woohoo!  I think we have a winner here.

And yeah, I am with the OP on this thread.  This needs looked into, for a number of reasons.  Now that I think of it, someone -might- have succeeded a snatch of something from Daeatria.  And she was mysteriously missing an item (thankfully, it was not an important item).  RPly, her elven thinblades are sheathed in magic pocket sort of sheaths (basically invisible), but they are still 'out' in her inventory.  One of them is sentient, and has not taken well to being in another's possession before. <.<  I do not want anyone having their hands on that without me or the DM knowing, for that reason.  

~Arya

[onivel]

May 30, 2014 8:51:54 GMT -5 oarthias said:

I was going to say, they are able to take items. It isn't limited to small items either. Anything outside of a container seems to be free to grab. DM story plot items included.

I don't think it is rolling spot checks for the other people in the area either, as I see anything taken from me, but when it's the person standing beside me, I'm not spotting it.

That is not a scripted mechanic... as I said, when I used it, we (the pickpocketer, the pickpocketee and any of those watching) would make publically broadcasted opposed dice rolls using the dice bags not the game engine. It was not a hard and fast rule, but it was one that I used to be fair to all around and kept things civil. If someone did not want to do it that way, I simply would not pickpocket them. 

Incidentally, all should thank a certain Red Wizard for giving my klepto a puzzle box to keep his hands busy and out of peoples pockets  ; )