The spell progression bug

[lurkerabove]

Regarding the bug that causes spontaneous casters to crash when they have a PrC that adds to spell progression: is that anytime they have levels in said PrC, or only when they've tried to learn spells that are outside their circle?

I ask because my newest PC is a bard that wants to bladesing, more for the RP flavor and her concept is -not wizard in any way. I would be perfectly fine taking the PrC and foregoing the bonus spells, mechanics be damned. But if she's going to crash regardless, then I'm stuck with a concept that I can't build.

Insight from the devs to the specifics of what caused the errors would be appreciated before I keep progressing her as I am.

[Edge]

It's the latter. As long as you don't try to have spells above the level and amount that your base Bard or Sorc level would allow, the game will function fine. It's only if you try to use an in-game system or LETO to add more spells than you should know, or spells higher level than you should know, according to your base Bard or Sorc level that it causes problems.

If you're fine with taking a class that doesn't advance your casting, then you can take Bladesinger or Dragonsong Lyricist or anything else as much as you like.

[Edge]

The crashes weren't happening until the players using the system tried to add new spells known. As long as you don't use that widget, there shouldn't be any issues.

[lurkerabove]

Perfect, thank you

[Fire Wraith]

Unfortunately it doesn't work that way - you can't avoid taking the spells, because the system will freeze you until you do. I'm not sure why it was designed that way, since it was something we adapted from elsewhere.

So, no, if you take Bladesinger levels as a bard/sorc, it will cause issues, unless you're already of high enough level for it to not cause you to learn spells of higher level than you natively have in your spellbook - that is, 18th level sorc for 9th level spells, and 16th level bard.

[Vincent07]

As a further aside, most of Bladesinger's mechanics rely on a high INT score.  It really isn't designed for CHA casters.

[Fire Wraith]

As another note, prestige classes themselves are not a roleplay prerequisite for the associated role. You don't need PDK levels to be a Purple Dragon, even a knighted one, nor do you need War Wizard levels to be a War Wizard, or Red Wizard levels to be a Red Wizard, etc etc. In almost every case, you have to be whatever role it is before you start taking levels in the associated class, and even then taking the levels is not required.

That said, I'm not as familiar with some of the established RP and such surrounding Bladesingers, but I'm fairly certain that if a character goes through the trials and IC requirements associated with earning the right to take the levels, you can ICly call yourself a Bladesinger, and act as one, even without taking the explicit levels.

[Arya]

This has not really come up before in my time in elfdom. But honestly, I am inclined to agree with what FW said. :-) People know me. I like doing what makes people play what they want to play, with the lore as just guidelines.


The game is old. We need to enjoy what we can of it.

Sincerely,
Arya

[Edge]

I stand corrected. I thought we'd removed the system used to add spells after it didn't work, and thus the lockdown effect it causes on Sorc/Bard characters. Apparently I was mistaken.

[Darvins]

heh oddly knowinjg some of the background on this, that was the next question actually, I don't think anyone would be too upset with them claiming the title while waiting for 16th level to hit once they have passed the Roleplay side of it to be frank. I know Galdern has always said when teaching he's not there to teach a formal set style but to help the Bladesinger find what form Bladesong takes for themselves. (Usually to explain how he can teach Longsword users truthfully but it works here as well) So not sure it breaks any background yes and if it does. Well it's a silly background then, lets go with whats fun in a case of NWN game mechanics getting in the way.

[bracethyself]

I agree, no issue with someone becoming a bladesinger but having to wait until level 16 to take the levels.

I would say however in order to take the title, even if you don't plan to take actual levels in the prestige class, you should have the prerequisites listed in the prestige class. For those icly trained by one of my bladesingers in the past, they have to have most of the prereqs before my character would train them.

Its one of the things that my character's required to be demonstrated before training can begin, along with RP and focus on elfdom that are the RP prereqs. That however is just my opinion based on the fact that bladesingers are a more specially defined theme than many prestige classes.

[Arya]

Oh! I did not think of the requisites part.

Good point. Requisites and the roleplayed interactions do need met still potentially.

I suppose it is not our call, though.

Admins?

Sincerely,
Arya

[lurkerabove]

So, if I were to rebuild her with wizard levels instead of bard levels....

Input from people as to how to reflect that she's already been actively RPing being musically and artistically talented, with original (by me) songs already performed, that she ICly wrote, and intends to write more, without wasting precious skill points in 2 point classes on ranks in Perform that really won't reflect the IC talent she's already demonstrated, since she can only then buy like, half her character level? I'm a stickler for playing my character sheet, and nqot acting out charisma points, skills, etc that my character doesn't actually possess.

[FaeFae]

Wizard/Bard/Bladesinger. Select to advance with the wizard progression instead?